This interview is perfection. Okay, great. Just do your best. Kate Bowler:You are someone who has gotten mixed up in all kinds of things, and I am so glad to know you. Today, were sharing this letter which Mary Hope wrote to officially introduce Alex because we find the kindness, transparency and unconditional love in it to be so inspiring. Despair defies description. Kelly Corrigan:Sure, my pleasure. Kelly Corrigan:Yeah. Thats where relationship lives is in these tiny moments, and whether you are cognizant of that and tuned into that channel all the time, or not, that is the story of a relationship. Your email address will not be published. They swell, and constrict, and break, and forgive, and behold, because its like this, having a heart. Were just a series of days and interactions. Kelly Corrigan:And Im getting to walk with them way longer on their road, and I felt this sense that I could never possibly deserve that, that Im not that great a person, or a mom. I go, Oh, thank you for that bit of suggestion.. This episode was wonderful, wasnt it? After the potency of the crime metaphor wore off, I turned to the vocabulary of religion. Kelly Corrigan:I mean, unless youre a monk, and youre meditating for 60 days in a mountain somewhere. He shares what draws him to people, how he writes them into stories and how openness and vulnerability are key elements to finding a strong character. Thats like total vanity but, especially with the kids, I definitely think, Edward and I both think, If you let us run this out for you, well get it done like one, two, three, and thats so humiliating, and degrading, and just the opposite of self-esteem building, which is sort of like the ground we walk on as adults. Claire, They hate it. The result is "Think Twice: Michael Jackson," a 10-part podcast from Audible and Wondery that will be available exclusively on Audible and Amazon Music on Thursday. Kate Bowler:Words matter. Maybe I dont have to be good, but I can try to be least a little better then Ive been so far., Riham:Our family motto is Allah Kareem. Kilpy The idea that we just sort of wander around, consume things until we die, like were just a series of small appetites without any deep, rich, meaningful, satisfying connection. Kelly Corrigan:Theyre never going to not do that, and thats how theyre going to raise their kids, and that means shes still here. Its so that they can identify some critical difference between you and them that makes them feel like they can exhale again. Minds dont rest. So, I grew up with this sentence with my fathers voice in my head saying, Allah Kareem, God is generous., Cheryl:Our family motto is, Dont eat a hamster. Kate Bowler:Getting back to life has been really tricky. Theyre poking for that critical difference to hold on to, and I wanna hug em, and say, I know. Maybe you want to borrow one of Kellys like, Its like this, but youre totally welcome to borrow my familys motto: Dont let the turkeys get you down. Its tried and true. Just see who you can bump into out there. Follow Kelly on Instagram, Twitter, and Facebook. Kate Bowler:You and I are super chatty people, but you make an amazing pitch for silence, and I am all for it, because everyone always had these go-to things to say with me like, You can do it, or Youre so brave, and all the things that made me feel like I was on the other side of plexiglass. Shed do dishes all day and into the night to just get to listen to her children, just to get to watch them through a one-way glass, you know? I mean, Im totally coming to see you. Its these seemingly trivial moments. This forgetting, this slide into smallness, this irritability in shame, this disorienting grief Its like this. Maya Shankar and Kelly Corrigan in Lafayette, CA. This is me writing a letter to Liz, and I wrote the whole thing, and I cried my eyes out the whole time I was writing it, and wiping my nose, and blowing my nose, and sitting back down, and Edwards like, You all right? And Im like, Im all right. Warmly, I mean, that means shes with them. You dont have to bring it all. We were living in Damascus, Syria, and whenever one of us asked for something Mom and Dad couldnt afford, Dad would say Allah Kareem. In Arabic, Allah means God. 5-Minute Listen. Its these seemingly trivial moments. Kelly Corrigan:I mean, thats where it is. Kelly Corrigan:Thanks. Whos going to do this? I love your style and all your guests are fascinating to listen to with so much insight and knowledge. Now, eleven years post-cancer, Im still learning to show up and be of use in my life, my marriage, my family and my work for the display of His splendor. Yeah. Kelly Corrigan:Yeah. More lessons learned. Kate Bowler:You put in a strong argument, if I may say it like that, for just being close to one another. Lives dont last. Kate Bowler:Yeah. It was because I had been selfish, and my dad caught me. Can we trust our gut? You are in good company. So, Dont eat a hamster is our version of Dont jump to conclusions.. with Kelly Corrigan When bestselling author Kelly Corrigan experienced the death of her dad and dear friend back-to-back, she couldn't shake the feeling that she wasn't living as gratefully as she wanted to. Kelly Corrigan:The magic of Tell me more is you start telling me what youre upset about, and I fall for the first thing you say, and I start solving for that. Leave a review on Apple Podcasts. She had ovarian cancer, so she had fought it for seven years, and it was the kind of thing where I felt like I urgently wanted to deserve my life. Our family motto is, We dont sell family. When our dog was a puppy and being housebroken, he kept sneaking around piddling in the corners of rooms. So, maybe when life is chronic, we all need some sayings to anchor us, our very own mottos that guide us through. Michael Murray on the Social Science of Faith Kelly Corrigan Wonders. Im sorry to ask about the hard part, but would you mind telling me what happened? Mahra:Ive been singing these lines from a song by the Avett Brothers to my kids for years, and it goes like this. So, its funny that that phrase really begat the whole book in a way, because I had been feeling this shame about not really earning my days here, and then Ed and I were at dinner, and we were talking about the difference between saying Im sorry, and saying I was wrong, and I was saying, God, its so much more powerful though in the humility in saying I was wrong.. You wrote about the end of words. So, I was wondering, would you mind reading that beautiful passage you wrote about after Liz died? Kelly Corrigan:I sat at my dining room table, which is place I never write, and I thought, Oh my God, of course I know exactly what this is. Kelly Corrigan:She cant wear half her clothes because she cant zip them by herself. Kelly Corrigan:Thats not a headline anybody wants to read. Kate Bowler:Thanks so much for doing this. Her memoirs include " The Middle Place," and her first children's. Kelly Corrigan:Theres a thing Im aware of about eye contact between spouses, and you either make it, or you dont, and once youre aware that thats deeply meaningful, and that it has this kind of almost immeasurable, physiological effect on the other person, then you make an effort to look them in the eye, and that seems like such a small thing, but its actually definitional in terms of your relationship, in terms of whether its a good day, or a bad day, or a good interaction, or a bad interaction. We can remove the first video in the list to add this one. Diana, Kelly Corrigan:Yeah. Maybe I dont have to be good, but I can try to be least a little better then Ive been so far., Riham:Our family motto is Allah Kareem. Each episode ends with a special Plus One segment, in which guests are invited to thank those that have supported them along their journey. I love it that it gives up perfectionism, and it just says, Hey, whats possible today?. We only book nice people who have a sense of humor and know things worth knowing. Plus, we learn how the same technique can actually reduce racism and prejudice. (To be fair, Ive loved all that I have listened to). This field is for validation purposes and should be left unchanged. Best-selling author Kelly Corrigan tries a research-proven technique to feel closer to her husband. Required fields are marked *. 295 Episodes Produced by Kelly Corrigan Website. So Kelly, welcome. Kelly Corrigan:So, I had to wait, and then finally we had a window, and I said, I was wrong. Find me online at @KateCBowler, and Id love to hear what you think of this episode. Kate Bowler:Well, I accept. Read more on this here. One of the hardest things Ive been wrestling with is not having any clear language for this weird place between sick and healthy, weak and strong. Kareem means generous. Kate Bowler:I guess Ill see you soon. Kelly Corrigan is the best-selling author of "Tell Me More: Stories about the 12 Hardest Things I'm Learning to Say," and a proud graduate of the University of Richmond. Kate, And the potted plant theory, I cant credit it to someone, Im sorry, I dont know who put it out there, but the idea is that if you were to have a plant in your kitchen, you might not be aware of it at all, and then if someone were to remove it, youd say What happened to that plant?. I rebelled. Kelly Corrigan:So, she had to call someone and ask them to come over and zip her dress so she could go to the wedding. We read and appreciate every comment. Jan, The idea that any day could be this huge day, I dont know, that really gets me out of bed, you know? Like, Im just an ordinary person, and I make all the mistakes that everybody else makes and maybe even 10% more, and then there she was, and what she would have done for the life that I was kind of rushing through, multitasking my way through day, after day, and you know, sort of feeling snappish, and then catching myself, and feeling like I should be different. This is me writing a letter to Liz, and I wrote the whole thing, and I cried my eyes out the whole time I was writing it, and wiping my nose, and blowing my nose, and sitting back down, and Edwards like, You all right? And Im like, Im all right. But the fact is if I said, Tell me more, go on, what else, youd say the next thing, and the next thing, and the next thing, and it would be like the thing behind the thing, behind the thing is where really the pain is, and if I had waited way longer, I wouldve been able to say, Oh, I understand.. You know, like it wasnt me. I mean, its a little bit like, Just keep saying yes. You know, When in doubt, say Sure, Ill do that, just to see what happens next, just to see who you might meet. Kelly Corrigan:Yeah, and theres forgiveness and acceptance kind of intertwined there that you know, youre going to forget. You can watch this episode of Tell Me More anytime at pbs.org/kelly.Thank you also to the Lafayette Library and Learning Center. One of the hardest things Ive been wrestling with is not having any clear language for this weird place between sick and healthy, weak and strong. My mom called me maybe three months after my dad died. I was also living only maybe 10 miles from my very old grandma who lived alone, and I kept kind of meaning to go visit her, but its a lot easier to show up at work every day at the United Way, and get kind of righteous about all the people who work for money versus the rest of us who are working for the greater good, than it is to go to your grandmas smelly, weird apartment, and have weird conversations with an 88-year old, you know? It doesnt end, and also you cant live there. Enjoy an intimate and heartfelt interview series hosted by author Kelly Corrigan. Kelly reads everything from eulogies to retirement speeches and on February 19th, she . Today, I get a chance to talk to Kelly about some of her very best phrases. Kelly Corrigan:Theres a thing Im aware of about eye contact between spouses, and you either make it, or you dont, and once youre aware that thats deeply meaningful, and that it has this kind of almost immeasurable, physiological effect on the other person, then you make an effort to look them in the eye, and that seems like such a small thing, but its actually definitional in terms of your relationship, in terms of whether its a good day, or a bad day, or a good interaction, or a bad interaction. Use one of the services below to sign in to PBS: You've just tried to add this video to My List. They thrill, and confound, and circle, and overflow, and disappear, because its like this, having a life.. Your mantra is fantastic and is sounds like it has served you well through the years! In other words, it could happen to you tomorrow.. I dont know. Kelly has also agreed to be my friend as part of her contractual commitment to this podcast. Our guest is Kelly Corrigan, a best-selling author and host of PBS talk show Tell Me More and podcast Kelly Corrigan Wonders. Dalai Lama XIV, Cheryl, Just get in the mix, get in the line of fire. She lives in Philly and I live in California. Thanks for sharing, Diane! For a special listener who was just diagnosed, here are some thoughts on the stages of recovery that I encourage you to share with every last person you know who is in treatment for anything. Im sorry to ask about the hard part, but would you mind telling me what happened? Gratefully, Writer Kelly Corrigan urges 2021 grads to choose curiosity over judgment Writer Kelly Corrigan is a bestselling memoirist. For Dr. White was the first person who ever told Michael he could write. They reel and wander and fixate and roll back and reconsider, because its like this, having a mind. Kate Bowler:Yeah. Constance shares her experiences as an actress in Hollywood both on and off screen: the privilege and responsibility of representation, being a true artist, navigating social media and an incident which took her to a very dark place.Special thanks to PBS for supporting Tell Me More and this podcast series. And you know, it was so weird, but dying was the easier part of it. My life doesnt exactly fit into neat categories anymore. For our weekly dose of wonder, NPR learns about glorious sounds chicken make at a very important moment in their . So, maybe when life is chronic, we all need some sayings to anchor us, our very own mottos that guide us through. Kelly Corrigan sits down with Melinda French Gates. You understand what you did wrong., Kelly Corrigan:So to me, that felt very different than saying, Im sorry. I love you both so much and was tickled to hear you together. When bestselling author Kelly Corrigan experienced the death of her dad and dear friend back-to-back, she couldnt shake the feeling that she wasnt living as gratefully as she wanted to. Kelly Corrigan:I didnt die. We can remove the first show in the list to add this one. The Big Short, Moneyball, Liars Poker, these stories stand for whole industries because Michael Lewis puts just the right protagonist in the center. Just get in the mix, get in the line of fire. So, thats just the question in front of all of us. The book is full of warm and witty blessings found within the struggles of our shared humanity, from theNew York Timesbestselling authors ofGood Enough. The successes of independent and feminist Marie Antoinette provoke jealousy and rivalry. Shes not going to their wedding, shes not going to pick out wedding dresses with them. But first, we need you to sign in to PBS using one of the services below. Im sorry I didnt go see your mom. Thats not the same as saying I was wrong not to try to know her. Kelly kicks off a new series on BELIEF, delving into topics like the meaning of life, finding purpose, why faith, service and gratitude matter, and more with Dr. MIchael Murray, former Philosophy Professor and current President & CEO of the Arthur Vining Davis Foundations . I went to see her one time. I guess everybody here, these children of mine and my husband, are just too damn busy to get on this, but Im not, so Ill do it, and then I was finishing, and I found a little pile of cut toenails on my kitchen table, and that. Just do your best. The reach of language can be laughable.. Kelly Corrigan:Like, almost every time Im sure that if you just let me take over, I can make this problem go away. Maybe Wills curious phrase, Its like this, applies here too. Kelly Corrigan:You know, that I had lost his favor for a moment, and I was just so ashamed. Maybe Wills curious phrase, Its like this, applies here too. Kate Bowler:Words matter. Mary Anne, Mary Anne, Im like, Yeah, right. As Teri said, He didnt have a drug problem, he had a life problem. Jennifer Garner tells Kelly Corrigan how she inspires others to find their true passions. Kelly Corrigan:And then she died, and my dad called, and my dad had nothing but positive things to say to me my entire life, and he said, You should have gone to see your grandmother more. Theres meatless Mondays, and theres a kombucha bar, and theres nap pods. Kate Bowler:Yeah. Onwards, but you use it so beautifully when youre talking about Lizs family and how they are now. My mantra for the last decade plus has been show up and be of use. Kate Bowler:Well, the one that we sort of settled on most was, Dont let the turkeys get you down, cause we were all deeply unpopular children, but it did make me think about mottos, and how it sort of defines the season that we live in. You cant only experience deep gratitude at the toenails that you seriously wish someone else would have cut, because seriously, whos doing this around here? Sadly, our family motto was, Youll pass in a crowd if the crowds big enough. My mothers mother didnt want her to get a swelled head, and she passed that down to us, her four daughters. My son was, of course, distraught and felt the dog was a part of the family and worth the trouble. What a unique family motto! Adjust the colors to reduce glare and give your eyes a break. Its a sin, its hell. Kelly Corrigan:So, I get it, but I spend a lot of time with them, and Im madly in love with them, really, really have this deep, incredible connection with them that I just value so much, and they are in her, and you know, theyre everything that was so important to her. I think earn is such a good word, because youre talking about such a complicated math. Kelly Corrigan:So, she had to call someone and ask them to come over and zip her dress so she could go to the wedding. We had several hamsters in one cage, and they can be cannibalistic, and one morning a hamster was missing, and another hamster had a suspiciously large tummy. I mean, Im totally coming to see you. I mean, people are getting colon cancer at your age all the time. Kelly Corrigan:Where you can feel the person kind of asking around, snooping just enough, and its not for your sake. Ryland was a light in this world who struggled with anxiety, depression and addiction. Youre giving these beautiful phrases, and each of them feels like a kind of roadmap, and you start with one that really resonated deeply with me. Kelly Corrigan:Yeah. The words we speak, and the words spoken over us. I guess everybody here, these children of mine and my husband, are just too damn busy to get on this, but Im not, so Ill do it, and then I was finishing, and I found a little pile of cut toenails on my kitchen table, and that. She totally doesnt get it. Were jumping in way too soon and talking way too much. I went to see her one time. You cant live in that. Team Everything Happens, Hi Kate, Michael Lewis sends his thanks to Dr. Arthur White, a former history teacher at Isidore Newman School in New Orleans, Louisiana, for kicking him in class whenever hed fall asleep.